I’ll preface this by saying I’m not from the US, I don’t live in the US, but I’m a neighbor to the US and have to deal with their bullshit just like everyone else.
As a left-leaning person seeing the right growing in power with every election (and every country), acknowledging that Democrats don’t hold my or my community’s best interests, but also acknowledging that they are closer or more adjacent to my views than Republicans and that we realistically are stuck in a 2 party system that forces us to choose a lesser evil, why shouldn’t I vote for the democratic party?
During the last presidential elections, the great argument that voting for Kamala was voting for genocide and whatnot was made. Can those who argued this stand here today and claim that their decision, their arguments, their views, were the correct assessment of the situation? Are your consciences clear knowing the hell Trump has enabled on Gaza, Yemen, and Iran? Knowing how much he’s empowered the billionaire class, the Zionists, the warmongers, the hateful, the corrupt?
There’s no alternative party, no momentum for one, no alternative system and no desire for change from the ruling class, and you’re stuck choosing between the literal worst group of people of our modern world, and people who aren’t as bad but aren’t great. Will you really argue, after primaries - and the chance to steer parties internally - are over, that both sides are the same and undeserving of your vote? Or that somehow voting for Trump’s party is the better choice?
I’m asking not because I expect you specifically to take blame or anything like that, but because this was the rhetoric last time, straight up MLs arguing in favor of voting for Trump over Kamala in a very unexpected turn of events that I simply could not believe or accept as anything other than a psyop by non-MLs.
Now similar voices are speaking, reminding everyone that both parties are the same in the worst possible moments to point that out. Not during the primaries, when the parties can be stirred into a direction, not at the moment parties register or organize, to have a fighting chance with a new movement, and not at the legislative level fighting for a more fair voting system… No… It’s always at the last leg of the race, between the two big parties, in a rigged system, when not voting for the lesser evil exponentially empowers the vastly greater evil.
Now similar voices are speaking, reminding everyone that both parties are the same in the worst possible moments to point that out. Not during the primaries, when the parties can be stirred into a direction…
Thanks for making it so plain you have the memory of a goldfish and nothing interesting to say.
We were saying it during the primary. Leftists been saying it every day for longer than I’ve been old enough to vote, and I voted the first time in a year that started with “1”. The fact that you don’t know that means you’re deliberately not paying attention except during the general when your billionaire-owned media programmers have programmed you to notice it and be offended by it.
The rest of the time you ignore it just like you ignore the massive dichotomy between Democrats’ rhetoric and their voting records. Just like you ignore the massive similarities between policy passed by Democrats and that passed by Republicans. You’ve been so programmed to focus on the aesthetics and the narratives that you routinely vote for the people making your life worse. Doesn’t that bother you at all?
As a Honduran who’s watched you idiots elect trump two times, actively making the world a worse place for EVERYONE, I quickly lose interest when people try to argue that Obama and the Clintons and the rest of the dems are or were just as bad. They carried out undeniable evils in the world, but the depth of the corruption and evil that has been unleashed upon the entire world purely out of the foolishness, borderline evilness, of Americans getting Trump into power TWICE… It’s impossible to ignore.
Trump has helped shatter this better image that Democrats had before all this, and it would be ridiculous not to acknowledge their role and positions, and I’m fine with doing so… At ANY OTHER POINT IN TIME BEFORE THE IMPORTANT ELECTIONS. Im not arguing in defense of the Democrats, I’m arguing in defense of strategic timing, and will continue to do so until you guys leave the rest of us no choice but to view you all as part of the enemy. Fix your shit as a country or you might force someone out there to do it for you the hard way.
They carried out undeniable evils in the world, but the depth of the corruption and evil that has been unleashed upon the entire world purely out of the foolishness, borderline evilness, of Americans getting Trump into power TWICE… It’s impossible to ignore.
And what, in your mind, Is the unique and horrible evil that Trump has perpetrated that Biden, Obama, and Clinton didn’t?
I’m not about to start listing the last decade of our lives to you just because you have some hill to die on.
Listen i don’t give a fuck if you need to kiss newsom’s cum-covered face to do it, just get trump and his one percenters the fuck out of office before other countries start feeling the need to do it themselves. Fix your fuckups.
The same billionaires who worship trump got me to hate him with their corporate powers, huh? I thought you guys were real communists who did real thinking, not just people who bend over for fascism and take it without lube whenever trump tells you to take it.
Whats the great plan here? To take it harder in the ass from the billionaire class while inhaling huge amounts of hopoum that the “revolution” will begin any day now? But until then we keep helping trump win? Go keep him in power like the useful lapdogs you are.
Your inability to understand a simply stated premise doesn’t make the premise wrong.
Your insipid screed only proves that you’re incapable of imagining any other exercise of power other than voting, and that you’re incapable of imagining the exercise of that power in any way you haven’t been given permission to use it by the people who don’t want you to use it to stop them.
Maybe don’t go back to brunch in between elections and start to think of people outside the US as human and you’ll figure out what we mean.
People are vocal about not voting for democrats all the time, you just do not notice when you brain hasn’t been primed for the bi-yearly vooooote
It’s election season, so it is not at all surprising that more people are talking about politics
Do you really think that any government would waste resources creating a tiny bot farm for some niche webforum run by communists? Get your head out of your ass.
Do you hold the same reservations when you see someone trying to get you to vote democrat? It’s not like they don’t also use bot farms
The report found that pro-Democratic activists using the hashtag #BlueCrew played a key role in spreading the discredited idea that the shooting of Trump in Butler was fake or staged.
NCRI identified 951 accounts that engaged in “coordinated inauthentic activity” associated with a pro-Harris campaign called #BlueCrew. Those accounts posted nearly 2 million times from July 10 to Oct. 10, “exhibiting behavior indicative of organized efforts to amplify specific narratives,” the report says, most notably the narrative that Trump was not shot.
Show me the last time they mattered for mofe than weakening the votes for one party or another. You guys could have a serious group of other parties, but you’re too dumb to realize th e system is rigged to have the two big ones, abd you’d have to change that system to change that status quo. The only time a party other than the big two will win, is when the billionaire class decides another party will join the fray, not when you guys, the people, decide it. You Americans seemingly just fail to realize this.
“If its not served up to me on a silver platter, then it is useless!” I wonder why it is that way.
As I just said, show me the proof you’re able to do this at this late stage in the process, because last time you all sounded like this, you got trump elected a second time like the dumb fucks you are.
Prove it. Point me to one person who is an actual principled marxist-leninist who is arguing that people should vote for Trump.
I’m not gonna go digging around Lemmy for post from nearly 2 years ago, especially since my original comment has already been deleted by a moderator. If you were here, you saw it or you pretended you didn’t. People here straight up argued that in a kamala vs trump decision, kamala was the wrong choice, and this was not a fringe opinion here.
1.That you dont notice at any other point in time says more about you than anyone else.2.The democrats themselves have no such qualms, gleefully attacking leftists at any possible point in time.
See, I don’t care that the dems have been meany to you, I don’t care that y’all say this at other points in time. I just care when y’all start sounding like this at the wrong moments in time, such as the time you guys elected trump a second time and all the rest of us around the world could do is watch in horror as we got plunged into another dark age… Which is EXACTLY WHAT HAPPENED.
Tough shit that you don’t like dems, right now, there’s no other choice, unless you’re telling me you’re finally going to put up arms and resist the system rather than bend over and take in in the ass again.
Do you really think that any government would waste resources creating a tiny bot farm for some niche webforum run by communists? Get your head out of your ass.
Umm hello? AI exists? It costs almost nothing to tell it to go to niche corners and push narratives? Any and all fears that were too far fetched to happen before, are a commoditized reality now. Get YOUR head out of your ass.
On top of that the war with Iran would have happened under Kamala as well
It could have happened under every president before trump as well, trump simply was the one who caved, as EVERYONE who lived through the first term would expect him to. ANY “kamala would’ve been worse” arguments are just removed to me. There’s no "would’ve"s, we got trump out of this bullshit and we’re all eating shit because of it, and I’m sure we would not be eating this level of shit with anyone else.
Listen I don’t know how else to get the point across, nobody remembers anyone going up against Hitler. They just remember Hitler and the people who put and kept him up there. The history books might mention Kamala, but her name is not going to be in everyone’s mouths when studying world history a few years from now. I am an outsider, unable to do anything other than just watch, and it is unbelievably infuriating to see you all harboring any sort of argument that improves Trump’s odds of getting away with all the shit he’s doing. Make no mistake, that’s EXACTLY what y’all are doing here. Silence me all you want, mods, but that’s just the truth. We all have growing amounts of hate for your country, and this bullshit doesn’t help.
Lmao this is the most asinine irrational bullshit I’ve read so far. You demand proof for third party votes mattering, yet blame third party voters for the democrats losing (even though there was no state where they made up enough to make a difference), you want proof of a third party winning the presidential election (the republican party would be one such example) despite that not being what I argued - Instead I argued your defeatism is the reason no such party can come to prominence, which you conveniently failed to ignore - you reduce the fact that Democrats dont adhere to “now is not the time” to “they were mean” instead of engaging with it as the refutation of your line of argument that it is, you manage to completely ignore the reasoning behind Trump being on par with Democrats and you finally make an ahistoric allusion to a fantasy version of how Hitler came to power. If I had a bingo-board for Liberal half-wits then you would have given me the prize already.
I am very happy it took you this long to activate enough of your long-dormant neurons to be able to hit the right buttons on the keyboard, because now there is no longer an audience so there is no need to adress you in order to speak to other readers, and since you’ve shown yourself to completely irrational there is also nothing to be gained from discussion personally.
So this is likely to be my last response to you in this thread unless you manage to make a surprising 180 and turn into a normal person capable of reason.
You’re totally right, I cannot believe I didn’t see this before. We need to keepthe fascists in power because reasons, and hope the revolution starts randomly at some point without further intervention. Any other decision is genocide, even though genocide only accelerated right now but its the right genocide because it’s trump and not kamala. Next time we need to pick trump over mamdani because mamdani is not a true Scotsman communist. Is that how it goes?
such as the time you guys elected trump a second time
You contradict yourself. The system is rigged, but the outcome is our fault?
Tough shit that you don’t like dems, right now, there’s no other choice
But also:
the system is rigged
So that means they read your ballot card, and murder you if you didn’t vote dems?
Listen I don’t know how else to get the point across, nobody remembers anyone going up against Hitler. They just remember Hitler and the people who put and kept him up there.
Hindenburg went up against hitler in the election. Hindenburg got elected, hitler did not. Then hindenburg appointed hitler chancellor. So if you want to compare harris to hindenburg, uhh…
Trump’s odds of getting away with all the shit he’s doing
You want trump gone because he blarts out the genocidal empire’s crimes instead of covering them up.
When I say the system is rigged, I mean you’re going to be stuck voting between two parties because you don’t have ranked choice voting , and you’re going to be stuck with unfavorable choices very often if not enough of you vote due to the electoral college. Tough shit, you still have to go out there and take part in the system unless y’all decide to dismantle it. Otherwise these stupid ass games y’all are playing end up choosing the worst possible choice and taking us all into the worst possibl e outcomes and I’m frankly sick of this shit already. I genuinely got pissed off at this community when trump won the second time because I remember your removed asses arguing that kamala was the wrong choice of the two, and there’s only two choices every time.
Its not that he’s so blatant about the actions of the empire, it’s that his rhetoric has changed everyone’s lives for the worse, I’ve lost friends and family to his bullshit, I’ve endured his decisions financially without even having a say about it, you fuckers DO have a say about it and wish to waste it away for short term morality points without looking at the bigger picture somehow. People really out here trying to argue trump is not that bad? Trying to question what’s so bad about him? Are you guys fucking for real here?
I’m telling this to everyone here: Listen i don’t give a fuck if you need to kiss newsom’s cum-covered face to do it, just get trump and his one percenters the fuck out of office before other countries start feeling the need to do it themselves. Fix your fuckups.
I’ll preface this by saying I’m not from the US, I don’t live in the US, but I’m a neighbor to the US and have to deal with their bullshit just like everyone else.
As a left-leaning person seeing the right growing in power with every election (and every country), acknowledging that Democrats don’t hold my or my community’s best interests, but also acknowledging that they are closer or more adjacent to my views than Republicans and that we realistically are stuck in a 2 party system that forces us to choose a lesser evil, why shouldn’t I vote for the democratic party?
During the last presidential elections, the great argument that voting for Kamala was voting for genocide and whatnot was made. Can those who argued this stand here today and claim that their decision, their arguments, their views, were the correct assessment of the situation? Are your consciences clear knowing the hell Trump has enabled on Gaza, Yemen, and Iran? Knowing how much he’s empowered the billionaire class, the Zionists, the warmongers, the hateful, the corrupt?
There’s no alternative party, no momentum for one, no alternative system and no desire for change from the ruling class, and you’re stuck choosing between the literal worst group of people of our modern world, and people who aren’t as bad but aren’t great. Will you really argue, after primaries - and the chance to steer parties internally - are over, that both sides are the same and undeserving of your vote? Or that somehow voting for Trump’s party is the better choice?
I’m asking not because I expect you specifically to take blame or anything like that, but because this was the rhetoric last time, straight up MLs arguing in favor of voting for Trump over Kamala in a very unexpected turn of events that I simply could not believe or accept as anything other than a psyop by non-MLs.
Now similar voices are speaking, reminding everyone that both parties are the same in the worst possible moments to point that out. Not during the primaries, when the parties can be stirred into a direction, not at the moment parties register or organize, to have a fighting chance with a new movement, and not at the legislative level fighting for a more fair voting system… No… It’s always at the last leg of the race, between the two big parties, in a rigged system, when not voting for the lesser evil exponentially empowers the vastly greater evil.
Thanks for making it so plain you have the memory of a goldfish and nothing interesting to say.
We were saying it during the primary. Leftists been saying it every day for longer than I’ve been old enough to vote, and I voted the first time in a year that started with “1”. The fact that you don’t know that means you’re deliberately not paying attention except during the general when your billionaire-owned media programmers have programmed you to notice it and be offended by it.
The rest of the time you ignore it just like you ignore the massive dichotomy between Democrats’ rhetoric and their voting records. Just like you ignore the massive similarities between policy passed by Democrats and that passed by Republicans. You’ve been so programmed to focus on the aesthetics and the narratives that you routinely vote for the people making your life worse. Doesn’t that bother you at all?
As a Honduran who’s watched you idiots elect trump two times, actively making the world a worse place for EVERYONE, I quickly lose interest when people try to argue that Obama and the Clintons and the rest of the dems are or were just as bad. They carried out undeniable evils in the world, but the depth of the corruption and evil that has been unleashed upon the entire world purely out of the foolishness, borderline evilness, of Americans getting Trump into power TWICE… It’s impossible to ignore.
Trump has helped shatter this better image that Democrats had before all this, and it would be ridiculous not to acknowledge their role and positions, and I’m fine with doing so… At ANY OTHER POINT IN TIME BEFORE THE IMPORTANT ELECTIONS. Im not arguing in defense of the Democrats, I’m arguing in defense of strategic timing, and will continue to do so until you guys leave the rest of us no choice but to view you all as part of the enemy. Fix your shit as a country or you might force someone out there to do it for you the hard way.
And what, in your mind, Is the unique and horrible evil that Trump has perpetrated that Biden, Obama, and Clinton didn’t?
I’m not about to start listing the last decade of our lives to you just because you have some hill to die on.
Listen i don’t give a fuck if you need to kiss newsom’s cum-covered face to do it, just get trump and his one percenters the fuck out of office before other countries start feeling the need to do it themselves. Fix your fuckups.
So that’s a solid “no” on being able to provide examples of Trump’s evil that are unique and not also done by Democrats?
Your entire political outlook is based on vibes you got from billionaire owned media?
That’s about what I expected.
The same billionaires who worship trump got me to hate him with their corporate powers, huh? I thought you guys were real communists who did real thinking, not just people who bend over for fascism and take it without lube whenever trump tells you to take it.
Whats the great plan here? To take it harder in the ass from the billionaire class while inhaling huge amounts of hopoum that the “revolution” will begin any day now? But until then we keep helping trump win? Go keep him in power like the useful lapdogs you are.
Your inability to understand a simply stated premise doesn’t make the premise wrong.
Your insipid screed only proves that you’re incapable of imagining any other exercise of power other than voting, and that you’re incapable of imagining the exercise of that power in any way you haven’t been given permission to use it by the people who don’t want you to use it to stop them.
Maybe don’t go back to brunch in between elections and start to think of people outside the US as human and you’ll figure out what we mean.
Liar liar pants on fire
There’s several alternative parties actually
“If its not served up to me on a silver platter, then it is useless!”
I wonder why it is that way.
Prove it. Point me to one person who is an actual principled marxist-leninist who is arguing that people should vote for Trump.
They funded MAGA to boost the Standard Dems’ likability. Schiff did this to Katie Porter in CA as well. They specifically do this so progressives can’t win
https://www.newsweek.com/democrats-skewered-republicans-funding-these-maga-losers-1758128
https://www.ms.now/news/angie-nixon-florida-senate-schumer
https://www.politico.com/news/2024/06/09/aipac-republican-donors-democratic-primaries-00162404
On top of that the war with Iran would have happened under Kamala as well
And finally none of what you are saying is in any way insightful. It is so tired and clichéed that I usually just link to the last time I wasted my time talking through those trite “arguments”
Show me the last time they mattered for mofe than weakening the votes for one party or another. You guys could have a serious group of other parties, but you’re too dumb to realize th e system is rigged to have the two big ones, abd you’d have to change that system to change that status quo. The only time a party other than the big two will win, is when the billionaire class decides another party will join the fray, not when you guys, the people, decide it. You Americans seemingly just fail to realize this.
As I just said, show me the proof you’re able to do this at this late stage in the process, because last time you all sounded like this, you got trump elected a second time like the dumb fucks you are.
I’m not gonna go digging around Lemmy for post from nearly 2 years ago, especially since my original comment has already been deleted by a moderator. If you were here, you saw it or you pretended you didn’t. People here straight up argued that in a kamala vs trump decision, kamala was the wrong choice, and this was not a fringe opinion here.
See, I don’t care that the dems have been meany to you, I don’t care that y’all say this at other points in time. I just care when y’all start sounding like this at the wrong moments in time, such as the time you guys elected trump a second time and all the rest of us around the world could do is watch in horror as we got plunged into another dark age… Which is EXACTLY WHAT HAPPENED.
Tough shit that you don’t like dems, right now, there’s no other choice, unless you’re telling me you’re finally going to put up arms and resist the system rather than bend over and take in in the ass again.
Umm hello? AI exists? It costs almost nothing to tell it to go to niche corners and push narratives? Any and all fears that were too far fetched to happen before, are a commoditized reality now. Get YOUR head out of your ass.
It could have happened under every president before trump as well, trump simply was the one who caved, as EVERYONE who lived through the first term would expect him to. ANY “kamala would’ve been worse” arguments are just removed to me. There’s no "would’ve"s, we got trump out of this bullshit and we’re all eating shit because of it, and I’m sure we would not be eating this level of shit with anyone else.
Listen I don’t know how else to get the point across, nobody remembers anyone going up against Hitler. They just remember Hitler and the people who put and kept him up there. The history books might mention Kamala, but her name is not going to be in everyone’s mouths when studying world history a few years from now. I am an outsider, unable to do anything other than just watch, and it is unbelievably infuriating to see you all harboring any sort of argument that improves Trump’s odds of getting away with all the shit he’s doing. Make no mistake, that’s EXACTLY what y’all are doing here. Silence me all you want, mods, but that’s just the truth. We all have growing amounts of hate for your country, and this bullshit doesn’t help.
Lmao this is the most asinine irrational bullshit I’ve read so far. You demand proof for third party votes mattering, yet blame third party voters for the democrats losing (even though there was no state where they made up enough to make a difference), you want proof of a third party winning the presidential election (the republican party would be one such example) despite that not being what I argued - Instead I argued your defeatism is the reason no such party can come to prominence, which you conveniently failed to ignore - you reduce the fact that Democrats dont adhere to “now is not the time” to “they were mean” instead of engaging with it as the refutation of your line of argument that it is, you manage to completely ignore the reasoning behind Trump being on par with Democrats and you finally make an ahistoric allusion to a fantasy version of how Hitler came to power. If I had a bingo-board for Liberal half-wits then you would have given me the prize already.
I am very happy it took you this long to activate enough of your long-dormant neurons to be able to hit the right buttons on the keyboard, because now there is no longer an audience so there is no need to adress you in order to speak to other readers, and since you’ve shown yourself to completely irrational there is also nothing to be gained from discussion personally.
So this is likely to be my last response to you in this thread unless you manage to make a surprising 180 and turn into a normal person capable of reason.
You’re totally right, I cannot believe I didn’t see this before. We need to keepthe fascists in power because reasons, and hope the revolution starts randomly at some point without further intervention. Any other decision is genocide, even though genocide only accelerated right now but its the right genocide because it’s trump and not kamala. Next time we need to pick trump over mamdani because mamdani is not a true
Scotsmancommunist. Is that how it goes?You contradict yourself. The system is rigged, but the outcome is our fault?
But also:
So that means they read your ballot card, and murder you if you didn’t vote dems?
Hindenburg went up against hitler in the election. Hindenburg got elected, hitler did not. Then hindenburg appointed hitler chancellor. So if you want to compare harris to hindenburg, uhh…
You want trump gone because he blarts out the genocidal empire’s crimes instead of covering them up.
I want usa gone because it exports annoying ads.
We are enemies.
When I say the system is rigged, I mean you’re going to be stuck voting between two parties because you don’t have ranked choice voting , and you’re going to be stuck with unfavorable choices very often if not enough of you vote due to the electoral college. Tough shit, you still have to go out there and take part in the system unless y’all decide to dismantle it. Otherwise these stupid ass games y’all are playing end up choosing the worst possible choice and taking us all into the worst possibl e outcomes and I’m frankly sick of this shit already. I genuinely got pissed off at this community when trump won the second time because I remember your removed asses arguing that kamala was the wrong choice of the two, and there’s only two choices every time.
Its not that he’s so blatant about the actions of the empire, it’s that his rhetoric has changed everyone’s lives for the worse, I’ve lost friends and family to his bullshit, I’ve endured his decisions financially without even having a say about it, you fuckers DO have a say about it and wish to waste it away for short term morality points without looking at the bigger picture somehow. People really out here trying to argue trump is not that bad? Trying to question what’s so bad about him? Are you guys fucking for real here?
I’m telling this to everyone here: Listen i don’t give a fuck if you need to kiss newsom’s cum-covered face to do it, just get trump and his one percenters the fuck out of office before other countries start feeling the need to do it themselves. Fix your fuckups.